Live Action Mafia

A game of sneakiness and paranoia
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:36 am 
Often in this game, the mafia will do mildly sketchy things, a collection of which probably implies there guilt but each one of which is play offable as innocent. Unfortunately, you can't really indict a mafia based on one mildly sketchy thing or even two, lot's of these are innocent play mistakes that anybody can and will make. This allows mafia to get away with a lot. I propose that here we write a list of mildly sketchy (i.e. made a shitty argument that they should have realized is shitty, were slow to get critical task done etc) things that players do.

Ways to use this list
"Hey 7 of the last 20 things on the list are by Jfrisch who has a tendency to defend players later found to be mafia, let's check whether we think these are valid and, when we decide they are lynch him!"
"Hey Ksedlar is playing very differently than the norm, look at all these poor plays by an ordinarily excellent player, it's very unlikely this is chance, let's lynch her"
Ways not to use this lynch
ZOMG, DGRAZIAN HAS SOMETHING HE DID POSTED TO THE LIST LET'S LYNCH HIM IMMEDIATELY111

In particular, don't interpret being put here as a claim that you are mafia, town players inevitably do at least one sketchy thing if they're active enough, I'm sure I do.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:38 am 
With that said, here is the inaugural entry

Daniel was much slower than optimal to state who we should lynch. (reminder, this is a mildly sketchy thing, it is absolutely and completely stupid to take this as much evidence of anything, in particular, it increases my priors that daniel is mafia something like 1-5%, which is basically nothing)


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:54 am 
Ksedlar ran for police officer instead of mayor like she usually does.

Josh suggested Asya quite strongly as an investigation target for asjm's death. If he were mafia, this might be setting up a frame a townsperson on Asya.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:29 pm 
I am getting major sketch vibes from ksedlar.
1) I don't like the fact that she was the only person to report about sueshep, especially when sueshep didn't publicly state her actions.
2) She was pretty against jfrisch in the ABC naming scheme
3) Since interrogation is gone from this game, there's no point in keeping either dukhovni or ksedlar in their position for long. Change up the bureaucracy!


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:36 pm 
I do agree that I've seen Ksedlar as kind of sketch. However, it's also a teeny bit sketch that Sueshep hasn't posted a thing yet. She might not have had the time--I know I'm hella busy these days, so why can't she be? But if I killed someone and was a vigilante, I would post about it. And a vigilante is a nice cover, since once they've killed they can't kill again. Harmless. Easily forgotten. So... sueshep we're going to need a post please and thank.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:51 pm 
I feel like I should address some of these issues now.

lilychen wrote:
Ksedlar ran for police officer instead of mayor like she usually does.


Pointing out I ran for PO last game and the 2014 IAP game. I was town both times. Meanwhile, I ran for mayor in the spring games and the first summer game, and I was mafia 2/3 of those times. If anything, me being police officer is negatively correlated with me being mafia. Me not running for something would be downright out of character.

ltchin wrote:
I am getting major sketch vibes from ksedlar.
1) I don't like the fact that she was the only person to report about sueshep, especially when sueshep didn't publicly state her actions.
2) She was pretty against jfrisch in the ABC naming scheme
3) Since interrogation is gone from this game, there's no point in keeping either dukhovni or ksedlar in their position for long. Change up the bureaucracy!


1. Sueshep can feel free to contradict me / report things herself. Dukhovni also could, since everything she told me was also in front of him. Not quite sure how me explaining the situation is sketchy...
2. Yes, I was. I am definitely less against it now that Jfrisch is dead. I still don't like it in principle, but it has now changed from "Josh's feel-bad way of attempting to get random lynches when I think we can do better" to "lynch plan Josh was advocating for before he died." I am a bit worried though that the correlation is TOO obvious though, especially since there have now been to people explicitly pointing that out.
3. Feel free to go around all of campus (or at least Random, EC, and ET), to fill out an impeachment petition. And then repeat the same thing in order to fill out an election petition, because they can't exist simultaneously. For reference, getting the initial election petition took over 3 hours. Or have a giant meeting with over half of game. If you're willing to do that, then I'm fine with getting new people into office.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:34 pm 
Also, isaacg was the first one to announce that sueshep was a vigilante; she told him, then was discussing it with us when we saw isaacg's post. At the time, we were still considering whether sueshep should reveal herself or do something else with the information she'd gained that led her to suspect arkadiy.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:13 pm 
I was thinking about ltchin's death, and I think in light of it, Ksedlar looks really sketchy, based on what ltchin was saying earlier.

Unfortunately, I'm ksedlar...

Anyway, I'm open to the possibility of being vampire-tested in light of this. People should discuss whether they think this is a good idea before any vampire tries to contact me though.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:30 pm 
I think it would be a good idea to vampire-check you, as well as dukhovni.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:36 pm 
Also, ltchin's death really doesn't look good for either ksedlar or dukhovni. Ksedlar and dukhovni are in UPOP with ltchin, and very likely would have known when ltchin was leaving the dorm. Moreover, if one of them was mafia, I would not be surprised at all if they conscripted the other.

I would like to impeach them as soon as possible and elect a new mayor and police officer.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:41 pm 
I think I'm probably sketchier than Sam, objectively. Sam not dying is not particularly noteworthy, especially since I've been around him so much. Also, him running for mayor was much more my idea than his. So I think vampire testing him, as of right now, is less objectively a good idea.

Vampire testing is more problematic than normal right now, since given ltchin's investigator's reports, conscript has probably NOT been used. So, no one should reveal particularly sensitive information (i.e. roles) to proven innocents who do not have a death timer on them. Moreover, I REALLY hate being mafia (as many players can attest), and so I would appreciate it if people don't do anything to make me a more appealing conscription target.

Again, I think there should be more discussion on this topic, and we should also have a good way of making sure at most one vampire asks for my role.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:45 pm 
Just post publicly once a vampire asks for your role.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:46 pm 
I think it may be worth it to test ksedlar and depending on what happens, test dukhovni later? Also I don't really know if we should impeach them or not but I think if we want to vampire test one/both, then we should at least wait and see what happens with that before we discuss impeachment.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:54 pm 
I don't see any good reason to waste investigations on us when we're vouching for each other if I'm getting tested tonight anyway.

Likewise impeaching me before I'm tested also seems very preemptive, especially since the impeachment and reelection processes take a while.

I do agree that me announcing as soon as a vampire asks for my role is good. Please not before 5 though since I'm not even technically allowed to have my phone out now, and I would have too slow of a response time.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:11 pm 
I don't think anyone wanted to investigate you? If you're talking to me, I was referring to vampire checking. Which is a good idea, and also it is a good idea for you to post immediately after a vampire reveals to you (:


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:18 pm 
I was responding more to Lily.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:35 pm 
Ok, I was thinking about not saying this publicly, but I am sufficiently sketched out at this point that I think I should say it regardless. In case weird shit goes down with this ksedlar vampire business, I feel like I should make this known:

I already know ksedlar's role, and the fact that she chose someone other than me to be her proxy for this vampire business sketched me out majorly. I asked her privately why she didn't choose me as her proxy, and her explanation was not all that satisfactory (for reasons I probably should not disclose).


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:36 pm 
Goddammit why are people posting things so publicly?

Also, sorry about that, Lily.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:42 pm 
I'm sorry if saying that publicly was the wrong thing to do. I was just incredibly sketched out by recent developments. Hopefully it all goes according to plan and what I just posted is irrelevant.

In any case, I don't think it actually hurt much for me to say that. Dgrazian, for one, said that my posting publicly that I know your role doesn't give him enough information to guess your role.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:52 pm 
I don't know if this is relevant, but I feel like I should let town know that ksedlar was insistent on me giving her my mic,
a mafia would normally do this, but I can reason with why a townie in her position would make this request.
Still, town should know about this cause it's a little on my sketch radar.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 3:33 am 
isaacg sketches me out because of him advocating for the vampire plan, which I feel was clearly incorrect. Looking through his forum posts for this game, he has been posting alibis/defending himself but hasn't really done anything major for town, which I feel is uncharacteristic of him.

isaacg said that he was advocating for the vampire plan before he knew his role. Can anyone confirm if this is true?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 3:55 am 
I can confirm isaacg talked about his vampire plan before game started.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 7:03 am 
I also confirm this (again)


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 8:36 am 
About being less involved in game, I will say that I am doing this, but for no nefarious reason, just being busier/less willing to put hours a day into game.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:11 am 
I can also confirm. I also trust isaacg a fairly above-average amount.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 10:10 pm 
Is nobody else sketched out that our mayor is still alive? I realize he might have been hard to kill since he's always with Katie, but if I were mafia and neither Katie, an excellent player and police officer, and dukhovni, the mayor, were on my side, I would think it would totally be worth using scheme to kill them both. I don't like it, I don't like it one bit.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:14 am 
I can see how that would be sketchy. Someone also tried to kill the people around him, but never him himself. I mean it's one thing to try and frame him, and maybe it just happened to be that they decided to kill everyone else but... it's kinda sketch.

I also got that preemptive pm from Katie. She said that he should be lynched if she died and he provided no other suspect. However, it's easy to implicate the only other person in UPOP. So maybe he's still sketch. Then again, lopezv hasn't said a thing on the forums (busy? live action active?) so I don't know about him.

Maybe there's something there.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:20 am 
I gave dukhovni my medkit when I thought I was going to be lynched. Then when it seemed like he was going to be lynched, I told him to give it to another player, which he did. This makes me trust him slightly more.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:20 pm 
I think it may have been a bad play for isaacg to post what he did about investigations.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 9:20 pm 
So there are a lot of people we haven't been considering as mafia, and I was going through the first starting information doc, looking for sketchy people. So far I've happened upon two:

Adamberg, aka Lotta. I wasn't in the ET game, but I know she was a lot more active in the fall game. She was handling petitions, active on the forums, all that. But now she's pretty much silent.

Lgunder very nicely pointed out his sketchness. If he were mafia, I don't know why he would would do that (false sense of security? false planted information would back him up?) But I do know that he was also headed to battlecode tonight, which is where isaacg was headed at the same time (class starts at 7). I don't want to frame an innocent (Ksedlar, lilychen, isaacg were all innocent), but eh. Sketch.


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