Live Action Mafia

A game of sneakiness and paranoia
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 Post subject: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:40 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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Danger level:
aok - high
beanboy - none (mafia)
brunnerj high
Daniel Grazian - high
iamm2w - high
karengao - low
ksedlar - none (mafia)
lukesci - none (mafia)
lyuyuan - very low (new)
megaol - high
mhguo - very low (new)
python - high
sammyluo - very high
Sir Nicoeus - high
vluo - none (mafia)
yyao1 - medium
ZoePasetsky - very low (new)

I'd like to kill Sammy right away as he is a super dangerous townie. I'd like to kill aok next for being pretty dangerous and his death allowing me to talk freely to Luke IRL, which will reduce the amount of typing I need to do (oof my wrists).

Everyone should claim their power here. I'm a roleblocker. Everyone should have a fake claim as well, which they don't volunteer to town until appropriate. With 4 mafia I think it's worth it to have two of us fake claim gay knight to intercept the gay knight coordination. Probably not me because people expect me to fake claim. Luke + someone is a good pair because Luke is experienced enough to be trusted to coordinate well but not so much so that people think he lies constantly.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:26 am 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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I talked with Sammy and said mostly real strategy things, except for the most important things (e.g. stalkers being the real provably innocent role which mafia can't fake for any cost and which can be protected with a single jailor).

I think we should use the following strategy:
vluo and lukesci publicly claim gay knights and try to be the game dictators
beanboy claims visitor (only if prompted). He uses the visit ability, his roleblock, and the mafia kill each day, minimizing the chance that he gets stalked as visiting the killed person. He is hopefully less likely to get roleblocked as a new player, which is good for having our kills go through.
I pretend to be a town jailor/roleblocker pretending to be a mafia pretending to be an arsonist. Claiming arsonist signals to the real arsonist that I'm faking and thus probably mafia. The arsonist would love to have a way to claim arsonist to mafia without claiming to town, so hopefully they contact me. However if they decide to beef me for some reason, I will have the cover that I will have claimed to some townies that I would be fake claiming arsonist. I'm typically a top kill target for mafia so non-mafia me would want to claim day 1 in order to avoid being killed; similarly making this fake claim will help me avoid suspicion for not being killed early.

If we do manage a successful alliance with the arsonist, we massively increase our killing power, so I think that such a scheme is worth trying. Notably the arsonist is similarly very dangerous to us if they aren't aligned with us; even them just acting randomly effectively causes a bunch of random lynches to happen, which is bad for us. An arsonist acting fully independently is probably better for town than a town vigilante, in fact.

If we fail to get mafia installed as the gay knight dictators, I am going to claim jailor to the real dictators (a claim that justifies the arsonist fake claim, since jailor is a powerful role). This will hopefully cause me to get assigned to one of the gay knights to protect; I can then simply kill them instead, and infer that I must have been roleblocked (mafia love roleblocking me when I'm town). Then hopefully the next dictators will be mafia.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 11:01 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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I don't think I've ever been mafia *with* Katie, this should be an interesting ride.
I'm happy to be publicly gay knight. It is weird that there's no disincentive to reveal roles!!
I'm a taxi driver. It's not a may ability, I think, so it has some downside as well as upside --- unclear. Mostly just sows confusion I suppose.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 11:07 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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I'm not sure that we can out ourselves as gay knights yet, though. At this point I think it'd basically be "yes, dictators sounds good, I would like to be dictator please" which is megasketch. Maybe wait and see what else town says? I'll see if I can come up with something that sounds plausible but actually leads discussion in a dictatory-but-unhelpful direction.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 11:16 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Oh, I agree with a high threat assessment of aok + sammyluo, but reminder that Meghal is in game so we can't *completely* ignore physical opsec when aok's dead.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:59 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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Yeah, don’t publicly claim GKs yet; wait for there to be some town consensus that that’s the right thing to do. I think all roles are “may” roles. Taxi Driver is better than Roleblocker to be claiming GK because you can swap yourself with someone who has a non-targeting role, so stalkers won’t catch you for doing targeting (GKs are typically non-targeting).

Hopefully Meghal leaves at some point (she has been here the past 3 days and no longer lives here so I think she should be over less than half the nights in a week). If not though let’s get her 3rd. Turns out I would literally kill to not deal with wrist pain lmao.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 2:57 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:55 am
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I am also a taxi driver. I’m sort of confused about swapping (e.g., what happens if I drive around person X, and a stalker stalks person X? How do we find people with non-targeting roles to swap with?).

If luke and I claim gay knights, then it’s probably least suspicious if I simply back up his claim while participating in normal townie discussion (I probably wouldn’t assume dictatorship as a town GK anyway).


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:14 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:10 pm
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I'm a roleblocker -- I'm probably gonna mostly chill for day 1 at least


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:39 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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++ vluo, just backing up Luke’s claim seems good. I confirmed with GMs that if you swap with someone and a stalker stalks you, they get stalk results from the person you swapped with. With the current town plan we should know some gay knight identities at minimum, so taxi driving yourself with them should make you look clean to stalks. This is some motivation for the taxi drivers to be the ones making the kills later, but I think for now it’s better for them to look squeaky clean, since they’ll be faking gay knights and therefore correlated.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:45 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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To be fair I would probably not step forward as dictator as much as a townie either. So that's a possible psychread on me. But I think it's believable enough.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:52 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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I think the scenario is that people are going to call for gay knights to reveal at some point today coordinate game, and you can be like, “Hi I’m a gay knight, I guess I can do that.”


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:43 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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Also in case it wasn’t clear, people should be around during the night phase 10 pm - 1 am to finalize on things to do.

It looks now like there is not going to be gay knight central coordination, and that vigilantes/gay knights/priests are just going to stay in a quantum state of unrevealedness. So Luke and vluo can hang out there and just taxi drive with other people in that niche. I think that means it’s worth it for them to do more of the kills in that case, since they can’t get caught for it via stalking.

Beanboy claiming visitor and doing the visit action still seems good.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:48 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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So Town Taxi Drivers can be potentially annoying for us, in that they can literally cause us to shoot ourselves. Let's only plan to shoot them if they are also roleblocked. Taxi driving a taxi driver and then shooting yourself also probably works (mafia taxi drive happens first so you should be shooting at the town identity unless that taxi driver also taxi drove with you specifically; roleblock on you would block your shot as well as the taxi so wouldn't actually shoot yourself).

Anyway, don't shoot taxi drivers without having a plan for what to do about their driving first.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:54 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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Without gay knight dictation strategy, there is less incentive to have lukesci/vluo claim gay knights; but specifically because of that it would be good town strategy to pivot tomorrow and make gay knights dictators anyway, especially given stalker interference. So unclear whether we should stick with that or not. The other option is to have one of lukesci/vluo claim vig and the other claim priest (I definitely think they should be claiming into the targetless rolespace because taxi driving can make them come up clean to stalks.)

Other people can give input, otherwise I'll think of something as things progress tomorrow.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:55 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Per GMs, using role powers is mandatory; at least for taxi drivers, you get a random target if you don't choose one.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:42 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:10 pm
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I want to post that you [ksedlar] should be executed; it's what I would do as town (i'm surprised that people are OK with you claiming a neutral -- meta I'm used to will have high odds of killing you on the spot since you're effectively another mafia member in the endgame) and presumably given that nobody seems super excited about executing you and that you've claimed stalker to people in private I imagine you will not be executed.

I'm not used to this meta/format though (noflip changes things so that I'm not confident there's much of a reason to not just hard defend your partners, i'm not sure how having everyone be power roles affects people's willingness to execute with/without hard evidence, and private comms changes the whole game dramatically), so I'm gonna wait till I hear back before hitting "Submit".


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 3:14 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
Posts: 0
I think it's good to anti-correlate us if it's cheap (my stalker claim will look increasingly fishy over time -- I tend to not last long as mafia so when I make my claims I lean into that). But you can probably get the same effect by saying something weaker like, "Seems to me like we should just execute ksedlar for being not-town, right?" which will get read by people looking back at posts as being anti-ksedlar, but without giving any arguments to actually convince anyone else today.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 5:13 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:55 am
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In discussion with meghal i've at least claimed a 'non targetting role', which I think was the plan anyway.

I think meghal is trying to vouch for "more coordination" (read: everyone roleclaiming); I don't know if this helps/hurts us, but we should probably decide what to claim in that case.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:01 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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beanboy, Katie and I think you should push harder for her (Katie) to be executed. She wants to have to reveal that she's not really an arsonist, to avoid vig shots and justify "being roleblocked". Possible arguments: arsonist is a bad role to exist for town, maybe esp. Katie as someone likely to think she can outscheme the town and the mafia.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:15 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Sorry, that doesn't quite make sense at the last there, I thought arsonist had to be killed by mafia to win. That makes arsonist much more dangerous for town though, since they can fully ally with the mafia.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:28 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:23 pm
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Current plan is for Luke and Victor to be “gay knights”. We don’t think a real pair exists, almost certainly not two.

And indeed beanboy you should push more for my execution (it will he stopped by python/Sammy/Meghal, so go crazy with the advocation).

Karen is real arsonist btw. No one should reveal to her and I think we ultimately want her dead due to her play style. Roleblocking her is better than killing her though; many other people we want dead first. No need for tonight though because she didn’t douse day 1.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:49 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Katie and I are in-person discussing who to kill. We think Sammy, Meghal, or Josh. I personally am pro-Meghal, any thoughts from the other 2 mafia?


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:18 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:55 am
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looks like sammy and josh were proponents of making luke dictator, and meghal was supposedly thinking i’m sketchy

i’d support killing meghal unless the others would take it as a sign that we’re mafia


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:21 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Sammy claimed Taxi Driver to me.
Josh says he and mhguo, a stalker, have been working together. Mhguo is going to pick another targeting role and verify tonight.
Python is considering roleblocking Sammy.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:24 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
Posts: 0
mhguo catching beanboy in the kill would be bad, so maybe we should avoid having that be possible tonight --- plan that during night phase. I don't think I can reasonably influence mhguo or get their target tonight.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:30 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Python will probably RB sammy.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 8:12 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Lyuyuan claimed stalker to me, I told her to stalk Python.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 8:31 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:08 pm
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Mhguo is stalking Meghal.
Sammy found an issue: beanboy claimed to visit sammy, sammy taxi'd with mhguo, mhguo claims not to've been visited. I feel like we should be able to figure out what happened here but idk what.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 9:08 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:55 am
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okay, so are we still having beanboy make the kill? (my interpretation of the last message is that beanboy would be under suspicion for fake claiming visit)

i assume luke will also be deciding who we kill tonight, as he is intaking town roleclaims and opinions.


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 Post subject: Re: Strategy Thread
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 9:30 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:10 pm
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Hm there wouldn't really be a reason for mafia to fake visit right? (since we really do have a visit... I actually did visit sammy)


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